Need some help getting a Tuya TS0601_thermostat to work

[ovizii]

Let start with showing you the basic settings I have it set up with.

The "problem" I have is that I have set up this one TRV for testing in a room I don'T often enter and set the desired temp to 16C. The external thermometer in the same room reported 18C for many hours while the internal thermometer of the TRV reported around 20C and yet when I checked the room, the radiator was piping hot and I could hear the that water was flowing through.

Checking HA I saw it at "position: 40%" and mode heating. Shortly after, it went to 0% but heat was still flowing through. If I check the history, there is no evidence of any heating happening :-( the heating I am talking about happened around where I put the RED CIRCLE, the heating on the left side happened yesterday when I installed it.

Question: are my settings from the screenshot correct for this model? Is the TRV possibly still in "learning mode"? I guess I am just nervous because I rarely enter this particular room, and now I find myself running there to check 10 times a day LOL

[G3Rn0t]

Are you sure, that your TS0601 needs to swap auto and heat?
I have 6 different TS0601 and none of them needs this setting. BTW i have set the TRV´s to manual mode and never ran into problems .-)

[meowmoo]

I have 5 TS0601 and also non of them need the swap option.

Also after lots of testing, I would suggest to use target based and not offset based.

[auanasgheps]

How do I know if the TRV requires the auto heat swap? I have TS0601 as well and I always turned it on...

[ovizii]

I ticked that box to swap auto and heat after someone's advice here on this board to solve a different problem. I have now unticked that box and set it to "target temperature based". Let's see how things fare.

Currently, the central heating is off.

This is the BT setup

Comparing to the original TRV without BT:

For some unknown reason it shows its been heating the whole time which is untrue, the central heating is off and the desired temperature is below the measured temperature.

Checking via Z2M:

Now I'll turn on the central heating and check if anything changes, without changing the desired temperature:

Nothing changed so no new screenshots except for the fact that this radiator is slowly getting hot. What now? Why is it still on position: 100% and heating although there is no reason for it?

I even started doubting that this TS0601 actually fits my radiator but I unpacked it, and directly replaced the old one without needed any adaptor or anything else. Also, the part that fits the radiator looked almost identical to my old non-smart radiator except the pin in the middle is slightly thicker inside the TUYA TRV.
Please help me out, I only bought one TRV to test, but I am planning on replacing another 4 so all TRVs are smart.

[G3Rn0t]

Your TS0601 seems to be different to the ones i´m using. I would suggest to put it back to "auto" and check again. Even i would suggest to enable debugging, to see what better thermostat is doing.

I´m using these types of TRV´s

[ovizii]

Thanks, I will enable debugging and see what I can find in the logs. I do have indeed a totally different TRV although its apparently the same under the hood.

Its unreal. I upped the desired temp to above the measured temp and its indeed heating the radiator but Z2M show the position as 0%

I'll be back after enabling debugging.

[auanasgheps]

Hey! I have the exact model as yours! First time for me :)
All my TRVs are the _TZE200_cpmgn2cf model.

[ovizii]

Just a quick feedback, I found this in the logs which means this model definitely needs the swapoption enabled.

2023-01-15 19:28:29.888 ERROR (MainThread) [custom_components.better_thermostat.utils.helpers] better_thermostat BetterBedTherm: climate.bedtherm HVAC mode auto is not supported by this device, is it possible that you forgot to set the heat auto swapped option?

[auanasgheps]

I have the exact same vavles as yours.
I have always enabled the swap feature, but disabled only on one TRV. I still have to receive this message.

But in your case looks like you should enable it.

[Azziral2]

The same problem, after reaching the set temperature TRV continue to heat up.

[Azziral2]

Moes TRV HY368

[wtom]

BT device info?

[ovizii]

Here is mine. Currently, it looks like things are working and the TRV is behaving, but the temperatures have cooled down and the desired temp is below the measured temp so in this case things seem to be working. Position is shown at 60% and system status is: heating. Will do some more tests this afternoon.

[auanasgheps]

What have you changed in the setup?

[ovizii]

What have you changed in the setup?

I am unsure what fixed my issue, but I have a theory. I'll also reply here after another day of testing.

I moved the TRV from one room to another one to avoid going back and forth while testing, and I think while moving it and removing the batteries I might have triggered some kind of calibration. When I mounted it onto the new radiator, I heard some 30 seconds of noise from the TRV.

I remember when I first tested a Siterwell TRV there were quite a few steps in a specific order one needed to do for a first calibration. As I have no manual for this TUYA TS0601_thermostat I don't know if there is such a thing as a calibration step. Can you check your manual?

[auanasgheps]

Yes, every time you remove the batteries it will re-calibrate.

[richsimpson]

I have similar setup. My valves have same Z2M info though the actual valve is a bit different to the picture. The info all on top for me as here:

Anyway, I find you must use AUTO SWAP as otherwise it is in Heat mode which is 100% on or OFF which is 100% off. Also Once Off, the commands are not received by the TRV to turn it up/down etc. A change in the dashboard doesn't land on the TRV.

I am still finding some overheat and some come on too low. I have used the OFFSET calibration and wonder now if any original change in the offset needs to be removed. So for example the one in my office was a local temp adjustment of -2, I wonder if that is factored in and screws up the algorithm of the integration. So it knows the valve thinks its 2'c out and then applies more... not sure.

I think you need to stay Auto/Heat swap and any change you make remember to reload the integration so it takes effect in the devices page. Else you are testing something that hasn't been pushed out yet.

[ovizii]

I spoke too soon. I opened the windows and the door for 5 minutes, temps dropped below the desired temp so basically the sensor measures 18C and the desired temp was 19.5C - the TRV seems to have started heating, the sensor has now reached 20.5C, and it should have stopped.

What happened instead is that the TRV shows: position: 0% and system state: idle all the while I can hear the water passing through the radiator, and it is hot as hell. It has now stopped about 5 minutes later. Maybe the BT algorithm is still learning?

[richsimpson]

The fact the valve shows 0% would suggest the TRV is closed (or as closed as it thinks it needs to be). I have similar issues but my valve is opting to stay open. So overheat is caused by valve sitting at 25% or 50% way past the target temp.

Could it be a sticky pin in the real valve (Hit it with a hammer) or a badly calibrated valve where it doesn't know the true open and closed positions. Batteries out and back in to recalibrate the positions.

[wtom]

I also had it once, that the batteries didn't have enough charge anymore to push the pin in all the way. Everything was showing no heating but it was still heating.

[Nuuki9]

What happened instead is that the TRV shows: position: 0% and system state: idle all the while I can hear the water passing through the radiator, and it is hot as hell. It has now stopped about 5 minutes later. Maybe the BT algorithm is still learning?

I have the same TRV and I'm getting the same thing - BT is acting as I would expect and the reported TRV valve position makes sense (and I hear the valve moving), but when its showing 0% its still red hot.

The battery was pretty low so I changed that yesterday (and recalibrated) but its doing the same thing today. The pin on the rad should be fine as its had other TRVs on it recently, so not sure what else to try.

Edit: I'm not sure that this is a BT issue. If BT is sending an appropriate target temperature to the TRV, then surely that's all it can do? If the valve reports as closed but isn't actually closing, then that sounds like it must be a problem with the TRV not closing the valve when it thinks it has, the pin being stuck or with calibration, no? My understanding is that these TRVs don't actually sense the position of the valve, which I assume probably makes issues like this somewhat more likely.

Am I missing something?

[auanasgheps]

Hi @ovizii, since you have the same model as me, can please check out #906, I have potentially discovered a way to fix this weird behavior

[auanasgheps]

Unfortunately I'm seeing a lot of issues with 1.0.0 and my TS0601. Last betas were better. I opened a new issue.

[ovizii]

I'm close to giving up. Here are the main problems:

• Its 10C outside, my desired temp. is set to 18C and somehow the TRVs heat the room up to 23C. WTF?
• I grouped 2 TRVs and 2 Window Sensors. All in the same room. 1 TRV is at position: 100% the other one at position: 0% - how the heck is this possible?

Only found this in the logs, not sure its relevant:

[ovizii]

If you read what's written in z2mqtt under system mode, then it's clear that you need the auto heat swap.

Perfectly clear, and I have that option ON for a while now and didn't touch it.

Also try target temperature calibration with AI mode.
The last posts were made with this exact configuration you just suggested.

[ovizii]

And please post your BT integration diagnostic logs.

{
  "home_assistant": {
    "installation_type": "Home Assistant OS",
    "version": "2023.1.5",
    "dev": false,
    "hassio": true,
    "virtualenv": false,
    "python_version": "3.10.7",
    "docker": true,
    "arch": "aarch64",
    "timezone": "Europe/Bucharest",
    "os_name": "Linux",
    "os_version": "5.15.76-v8",
    "supervisor": "2022.12.1",
    "host_os": "Home Assistant OS 9.4",
    "docker_version": "20.10.19",
    "chassis": "embedded",
    "run_as_root": true
  },
  "custom_components": {
    "better_thermostat": {
      "version": "1.0.0",
      "requirements": []
    },
    "scheduler": {
      "version": "v0.0.0",
      "requirements": []
    },
    "hacs": {
      "version": "1.29.1",
      "requirements": [
        "aiogithubapi>=22.10.1"
      ]
    },
    "remote_homeassistant": {
      "version": "3.6",
      "requirements": []
    },
    "thermal_comfort": {
      "version": "2.0.1",
      "requirements": []
    },
    "watchman": {
      "version": "0.5.1",
      "requirements": [
        "prettytable==3.0.0"
      ]
    }
  },
  "integration_manifest": {
    "domain": "better_thermostat",
    "name": "Better Thermostat",
    "documentation": "https://github.com/KartoffelToby/better_thermostat",
    "issue_tracker": "https://github.com/KartoffelToby/better_thermostat/issues",
    "iot_class": "local_push",
    "version": "1.0.0",
    "config_flow": true,
    "dependencies": [
      "climate",
      "recorder"
    ],
    "after_dependencies": [
      "climate"
    ],
    "codeowners": [
      "@kartoffeltoby"
    ],
    "requirements": [],
    "is_built_in": false
  },
  "data": {
    "info": {
      "name": "Lounge",
      "temperature_sensor": "sensor.loungetemphum_temperature",
      "off_temperature": 18,
      "humidity_sensor": "sensor.loungetemphum_humidity",
      "weather": "weather.home_hourly",
      "window_off_delay": 30,
      "window_sensors": "binary_sensor.lounge_windows",
      "outdoor_sensor": null,
      "model": "TS0601_thermostat/TS0601_thermostat"
    },
    "thermostat": {
      "climate.loungetherml": {
        "name": "LoungeThermL",
        "state": "auto",
        "attributes": {
          "hvac_modes": [
            "heat",
            "auto",
            "off"
          ],
          "min_temp": 5.0,
          "max_temp": 35.0,
          "target_temp_step": 0.5,
          "preset_modes": [
            "none",
            "schedule",
            "manual",
            "boost",
            "complex",
            "comfort",
            "eco",
            "away"
          ],
          "current_temperature": 24.0,
          "temperature": 17.5,
          "hvac_action": "off",
          "preset_mode": "manual",
          "friendly_name": "LoungeThermL",
          "supported_features": 17
        },
        "bt_config": {
          "calibration": "target_temp_based",
          "calibration_mode": "heating_power_calibration",
          "protect_overheating": false,
          "no_off_system_mode": false,
          "heat_auto_swapped": true,
          "valve_maintenance": false,
          "child_lock": false,
          "homaticip": false
        },
        "bt_adapter": "mqtt",
        "bt_integration": "mqtt",
        "model": "TS0601_thermostat"
      },
      "climate.loungethermr": {
        "name": "LoungeThermR",
        "state": "auto",
        "attributes": {
          "hvac_modes": [
            "heat",
            "auto",
            "off"
          ],
          "min_temp": 5.0,
          "max_temp": 35.0,
          "target_temp_step": 0.5,
          "preset_modes": [
            "none",
            "schedule",
            "manual",
            "boost",
            "complex",
            "comfort",
            "eco",
            "away"
          ],
          "current_temperature": 22.5,
          "temperature": 18.5,
          "hvac_action": "off",
          "preset_mode": "manual",
          "friendly_name": "LoungeThermR",
          "supported_features": 17
        },
        "bt_config": {
          "calibration": "local_calibration_based",
          "calibration_mode": "heating_power_calibration",
          "protect_overheating": false,
          "no_off_system_mode": false,
          "heat_auto_swapped": true,
          "valve_maintenance": false,
          "child_lock": false,
          "homaticip": false
        },
        "bt_adapter": "mqtt",
        "bt_integration": "mqtt",
        "model": "TS0601_thermostat"
      }
    },
    "external_temperature_sensor": {
      "entity_id": "sensor.loungetemphum_temperature",
      "state": "21.75",
      "attributes": {
        "state_class": "measurement",
        "unit_of_measurement": "\u00b0C",
        "device_class": "temperature",
        "friendly_name": "LoungeTempHum temperature"
      },
      "last_changed": "2023-01-19T21:49:07.420918+00:00",
      "last_updated": "2023-01-19T21:49:07.420918+00:00",
      "context": {
        "id": "01GQ603JEWP91G37WRZ73ZFQRG",
        "parent_id": null,
        "user_id": null
      }
    },
    "window_sensor": {
      "entity_id": "binary_sensor.lounge_windows",
      "state": "off",
      "attributes": {
        "entity_id": [
          "binary_sensor.loungecontactwindowl_contact",
          "binary_sensor.loungecontactwindowr_contact"
        ],
        "device_class": "window",
        "icon": "mdi:window-closed-variant",
        "friendly_name": "Lounge Windows"
      },
      "last_changed": "2023-01-19T21:36:23.001378+00:00",
      "last_updated": "2023-01-19T21:36:23.001378+00:00",
      "context": {
        "id": "01GQ5ZC7TPJ062CFJ0S5JVS2K6",
        "parent_id": null,
        "user_id": null
      }
    }
  }
}

[wtom]

The calibration mode is different on both. One target temperature and the other local calibration. I actually don't know if that works.

And i don't know why the HVAC Action is off instead of idle.

[ovizii]

Thanks for pointing that mistake out. When saving 2 TRVs in one BT integration when saving, you get asked about those settings for both TRVs and I thought I had mis-clicked and simply saved again without checking and changing the second TRV's settings. Now both are ion target temperature mode.

As for the HVAC mode, these TRVs only report these 3 modes as you can see above and "idle" isn't mentioned anywhere.

"attributes": {
          "hvac_modes": [
            "heat",
            "auto",
            "off"
          ],

[wtom]

Mode is different from action. So action idle all of them have.

[ovizii]

I have another question:

How do I make sure the TRV actually works with my radiator?
Do TRVs have different lengths pins inside (I mean the pin which actually opens and closes the valve)?

I started to doubt that it is a software issue. My central heating just turned on and all TS0601_thermostat heated up although none of them showed any change in position nor any indication of heating happening.

[wtom]

I know from some people, they put a small coin inside, to make the distance smaller.

Put them on maximum temperature. Take them off, put a coin. Put them back. Take out batteries to force recalibration. See what happens.

[ovizii]

I know from some people, they put a small coin inside, to make the distance smaller.

Put them on maximum temperature. Take them off, put a coin. Put them back. Take out batteries to force recalibration. See what happens.

Very good advice, I just read the reviews on the platform I bought them and one guy said he sent them back because the "motor is too weak to completely close the valve" to which somebody replied he added thin magnets and it works so I ordered a couple of magnets, 4mm diameter and 2mm thickness. That sounds like it should solve the problem.

[Nuuki9]

I know from some people, they put a small coin inside, to make the distance smaller.
Put them on maximum temperature. Take them off, put a coin. Put them back. Take out batteries to force recalibration. See what happens.

Very good advice, I just read the reviews on the platform I bought them and one guy said he sent them back because the "motor is too weak to completely close the valve" to which somebody replied he added thin magnets and it works so I ordered a couple of magnets, 4mm diameter and 2mm thickness. That sounds like it should solve the problem.

Please report back on how it goes!

[ovizii]

Inserting a magnet with 4mm diameter and 2mm thickness inside each TRV seems to have fixed the problems with the position reporting 0% but the valve actually still being open.
Now when the TRV reports position 0% the valve is actually fully closed.
I'm not sure if these 2mm I have now effectively "lost" mean that when the position reports 100% the valve is not actually 100% open but I don't care at this point as it just means I'm heating a little slower.

On the other hand, I still haven't turned the PID of my TRV off as was explained here: #906 and yes, it feels like having a dog on a rubber-leash, you can't fully start or stop the heating as the TRVs themselves act like a rubber-band due to their PID.

i.e. I have 2 TRV in a group as one BT device and I set it to 20C while having measured 18C which means both TRVs should be heating. One is at position 80% the other one at 5%.

I guess turning off the PID should fix this.

EDIT:

one more thing, since I switched BT to target temperature mode, the value "local_temperature_calibration" of my TRVs should be 0, right? I found 2 of them with -6 and -1 respectively and have reset them to 0 manually, just checking I am not messing around with BT.

Also I have still observed a problem when the TRV synced the BT target temperature to the internal one of the TRV so BT was showing a desired temperature of 35C which should never happen, never, ever, touch my BT desired temperature, there is just no explanation for this except it being a bug. Thoughts?

[auanasgheps]

it feels like having a dog on a rubber-leash,

lol I laughed!

one more thing, since I switched BT to target temperature mode, the value "local_temperature_calibration" of my TRVs should be 0, right? I found 2 of them with -6 and -1 respectively and have reset them to 0 manually, just checking I am not messing around with BT.

Yeah, I observed the same thing. Turn off BT entities, set all the calibration values to 0 and turn it on. It still should not matter since it will offset whatever temp the TRV will report.

Also I have still observed a problem when the TRV synced the BT target temperature to the internal one of the TRV so BT was showing a desired temperature of 35C which should never happen, never, ever, touch my BT desired temperature, there is just no explanation for this except it being a bug. Thoughts?

Looks like a bug. But when you change calibration things can break. The recommendation is to delete the old entities and re-create them.

[tbandras]

Let me start by saying that I've read through both this topic and the one made by @auanasgheps #906 but I still could not find the solution to my problem. If it was spelled out there, I apologise.

My setup:

• I use 2 Moes TS0601 TRV's connected with Z2M in Home Assistant
• Both BT's are configured with swapping auto/heat, otherwise it does not work. I think this is the right configuration för these TRV's, as confirmed on this topic.
• BT configuration is offset-based
• overheating protection in the BT configuration is enabled
• I use simple thermostat cards where I also added the Valve position % that Z2M can deliver directly with the integration
• the external sensors are Xiaomi BLE sensors flashed with the prvv custom firmware
• The boiler itself is controlled by a central thermostat. Due to this it can happen that the TRV would call for heat, but the boiler does not react as the room where the central thermostat is is already at the desired temperature. The central thermostat will eventually be replaced ny a relay switch, so individual thermostats can call for heat on demand.

With all that said, I noticed that the target temperature, the current temperature and the valve position are not in direct correlation. I am having a hard time understanding the connection.

I edited the office thermostat based on the other topic. What I see post that is that the valve position is pretty much 0 or 100%, there is barely anything in-between.

Even so, you see that the valve position is often fully open even though the situation would not call for it (room temp is above target temp)

If I set the valve type to PID on the TRV itself - and this is the setup I use in the bedroom, as it's the default on the TRV - then the graph looks at least a bit more consistent, but still it overheats big time.

Still, there are situations when the system opens the valve for seemingly no reason. The room temp is higher than the target temp. In this case, even though the simple thermostat card says the state is "idle", if the valve is open at 25% and the boiler is running (which is the case if the living room calls for heat), it will also heat the radiator.in the bedroom

Is this a case of improper configuration, or this kind of overheating should be acceptable with setups like this? Is it a matter of the TRV reacting too slowly or the BT AI algorithm doing its own thing? If I were to use a more expensive, generally well-received TRV (Shelly, Tado Honeywell etc.) would I experience the same?

[auanasgheps]

Try using Temperature calibration and not offset calibration (it's way more precise), along with TRV PID disabled.

Delete BT entities, re-add them using Temperature calibration and let us know.

[tbandras]

I've changed now the configuration for 1 room out of the 2, so I can compare the behaviour.

This is from today and again, I cannot explain the valve control here

[I-Would-Like-To-Report-A-Bug-Please]

Still, there are situations when the system opens the valve for seemingly no reason. The room temp is higher than the target temp. In this case, even though the simple thermostat card says the state is "idle", if the valve is open at 25% and the boiler is running (which is the case if the living room calls for heat), it will also heat the radiator.in the bedroom

Sorry to hijack @tbandras, what's the name of this nice card that display status of the climate? Just tried to go look through HACS and couldn't find anything with temp/climate in the name

[ovizii]

The boiler itself is controlled by a central thermostat. Due to this it can happen that the TRV would call for heat, but the boiler does not react as the room where the central thermostat is is already at the desired temperature. The central thermostat will eventually be replaced ny a relay switch, so individual thermostats can call for heat on demand.

@tbandras that is what I had planned too except I just realized that I cannot use the sonoff zbmini-l as it apparently requires 100-240V and my boiler seems to only run 12V or less to the wall thermostat.
I really would have liked a simple switch, but I can't find a solution. So now I have started looking at smart wall thermostats, planning to dumb them down so that the TRVs can call for heat whenever except the ones I found also seem to need at least 100V.

Do you have a proper solution planned out which you can share?

[ovizii]

A Shelly plus 1 has a 12V input. Could be used as a simple switch for you.

That fits and looks exactly what I need except it says: “Neutral required: Yes” and I only have 2 wires going from the boiler to the current wall thermostat. Any other ideas? OR does the neutral wire refer to the AC voltage?

[wtom]

Hmm, then i don't know. I think it difficult with just having the 2 wires available. Because somehow you need to run the switch, i think.

[tbandras]

My current "dumb" thermostat ( Computherm Q3RF) had only 4 wires (2 from the socket, 2 from the boiler), so I believe the Shelly 1/Plus 1 is the adequate tool for this job (I already bought those relays myself)

Hopefully this can clarify this for you

[ovizii]

Thanks, mine is very similar except for the external power:

This is what mine looks like. Those two wires are coming straight from the boiler just like in your drawing.

[tbandras]

I thought I would post the schematics of the system I implemented. Maybe in my case it's a bit overcomplicated, as I built in 2 regular thermostats as safety mechanism in case Home Assistant and/or the Shelly would fail. This way there is a lower and upper threshold defined by those thermostats in case the home automation system would fail and in-between those the boiler is controlled by the Shelly.

[richsimpson]

I would say join the wires in the thermostat so it is on (but trial by just turning it to max).

Then at the boiler end where those wires enter, use something that is a relay to open close.

Many of the Sonoff Basic can be altered so the switch is not passing 240v through from one side to the other. Often used fro garage door automation and so a relay for on or off (connect or disconnect). I think maybe the Shelly do that too?

That way the Sonoff Basic is plugged in to mains, And just connecting the wires over, same as hot/cold = on/off. I have a smart thermostat (Nest) that is now being set as 15'C for OFF and 24'C for ON . My smart thermostat has become dumb for my use case...