Prerequisites for System Drive too low #131
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How much ram does your system have? The docs say the drive should be "but more than the capacity of the RAM". 4GB is possible but not if your system has a lot of ram because the installer will create a larger swap space for larger amounts of ram. I have a fresh install that only uses 1.7G of space and I had no problem installing updates. |
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I read that specification in the docs, and I indeed set up 1 GB of RAM and 4 GB of System Drive, which according to the docs should be the absolute minimum. Still, that is the error that came out upon upgrade. Did you do it recently? As you can see, the upgrade that makes it fail is the new kernel. |
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My install is from December. I even reverted to snap and install two months of updates. I might not have install with the OMV iso (don't remember). I have a running cm3588 install that is only using 2.9G. Maybe it is harder to keep it small with amd64. I guess I use 16G or larger when creating VMs just to be safe. Maybe the minimum could stay 4G but a "recommended" could be added. |
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I would suggest saying that 4 GB are sufficient for running OMV, but that in case of large upgrades (such as this one) that could not be enough. But still, what's the largest upgrade that could ever be distributed? |
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Hard to say. It could conceivably be almost every package on the system the way some OMV users skip updates for a year or more. |
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I started with a 4GiB DOM, but now i'm on 16GiB. 4GiB can be OK, but only when no additional plugins are installed. @lucabosc What is your recommendation? How much disk space should be the minimum? |
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Hi @votdev. In my case, 4GB were not sufficient to run an upgrade which included a new kernel on a fresh install with no plugins. Clearly, how much it would be appropriate to increase the minimum depends on how large future upgrades will be, which we cannot know for sure. Given that a recent kernel, once installed, can take at most 0.5 GB, plus the compressed space of the package itself, most likely 1-2 GB more should be enough. In my case, I extended the root partition from 4 to 8 GB and everything went fine. |
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I agree the recs are unclear and stumbled on it a bit (and resized multiple times) - maybe say something like (or provide "minimum" and "recommended" separately):
Things that will consume disk space that will factor in:
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To address this issue I will replicate an installation on a 4GB disk to determine how feasible this environment is. So then we can determinate a way or witch requirements are really need and witch are really possible or not.. i post feedback later |
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4GB might be enough for a fresh system but after the system has been around a while and possibly not patched frequently, 4GB will not be enough especially to update the system. No need to test. I have seen this problem many, many times on the forum and in my testing. |
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ok i setup a minimal isntall but BUT using debootstrap (if you use netinstall or any other will not work) and disabling any recommends and suggests in package manager.. also setup of previous packages for OMV was done using minimal needs.. by example always purging apt cache.. and disabling apt gpg keys using trusted repos.. found that with a 4G disk a 3G partion is possible and enough for a minimal share.. i setup a 1G share and regular updates must be using apt-cache purge.. all the updates must be done manually cos automated updates need extra packages.. some plugins are out of the formula by example ftp .. i am talking about oficial OMV packages.. means: there is no problem.. 4G fits.. but you need a minimal installation, apt cache clean peridically of downloaded packages, partial minimal upgrades (you cannot upgrade buch of packages that fill all the rest of the disk space of course) @ryecoaaron if need i will made a youtube video.. after solved the password trisks |
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No need to make a video. I am well aware of how to make a smaller install. But the packages are not what use most of the space after the system has been running for a while. Trying to use 4G can be done by someone with good linux skills if the system has very few services running. It is too small for most OMV users. It is hard to find storage that small these days and people should not be using old storage. Feel free to use 4gb in system but the docs should not change. |
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The OMV always installs all updates from the Update tab or using onv-upgrade. People should be able to upgrade from the web interface. |
umm this maybe coudl be a reason to.. i will leave running the 4G installation to demostrate is valid.. but.. if the "Update tab" always install all the updates.. and the download package of the apt/cache fill all available space.. then 4G is not a valid point.. i will propose a change that may liked to you all guys.. let me find a way, but there is no need of skills after a 4G install is well setup following a good guide.. |
* it addressed and close openmediavault#131 * improves the very vage requirements documentation * OMV is the most flexible NAS system pointed that * separate software requirements and hardware requirements * software requirementes are handled by OS and depends but pointed some packages that are important for * pointed that the OS Debian is the main software requisite * Page must be titled as "requirementes" cos hardware are prerequisited but those depends on software main one: the Debian OS, if such hardware is not supported so OMV could not be installed or worked in good way.. so prerequisites as list are very confused about it * set that minimal requirements are fit and able to manage: * a root fs partiton of 1.5G was enough using netinstall iso, and deactivating recommends, after that setup no automatic updates and create cron task to clean apt package cache. this dont allow upgrades but allows updates. * a swap of 100M was enough i setup linux to do not use swap in any case.. but novice user wil not have skilss so .. * of course those are for skilled users.. so write sections of recommendations for novice users * setup a NAS system is easy with OMV but a minimal of knowledge is required for non experienced users, so write such need in each section. **Warning** i put that 1 disk is enought as storage drives, that is basically officially true adn supported, if you as skilled adminstrator just install OMV over fresh debian setup! this could be by leaving a free partition already formated!
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Ok, i setup 4G installation, but using bootstrap...resiserfs4 kernel and also normal official Debian kernel... both cases for this..
4G install are possible for semi-novices.. with minimal knowledge,, using defaults the only key is not the usage of the web gui for updates.. with simple manual updates over terminal is easy managed..
not so true! i made possible 4G runing system by updated just on each notification..
yes so accumulation of packages will be not so big and also ALWAYS CLEARING APT CACHE.. (that can be made also from web UI).. so so in conclusionis clearly stated in the documentation that minimum is not the same as recommended, when we talk about minimum we are talking about the fact that the person who administers must know or have minimum knowledge, if they do not have it they should go for the recommended ones. my proposal@ryecoaaron i expanded the documentation with #142 and i hope main developer approves.. BUT since it is understandable! developers do not understand this behavior to less experienced users ,BUT the documentation is correct, just a bit rough., |
* Addressed and closed openmediavault#131, requirements talk about installation, not updates (not manageable updates), so the wording is correct because later on there are points about that, but i handled the issue in this commit in better way for. * Improve the very vague requirements documentation, that is also ambiguous in some way. * Not all software requirements are handled by the OS, for example we need a valid network for communications, if the network is unreachable clients are unable to reach any shared resources. * OMV is the most flexible NAS system. Pointed that out and tried to clarify all the needs about hardware and software. * Separate software requirements and hardware requirements. Previous document was very mixed about it, maybe this commit featured a too long one. I'm open to suggestions and leave this PR open to the editors and maintainers for. * Pointed out that Debian OS is the main software requirement. So then hardware requirements will rely based on OS hardware support! * Pointed out that NIC is a missing hardware requirement and why. It's a NAS system and wrote about that terminology as well. * Software requirements are handled by the OS and depend on it, but some packages were pointed out that are important to it, so there will be no confusion about it * The page should be titled "requirements" because hardware is a prerequisite, but it depends on the core software - the Debian OS, if such hardware is not supported, OMV would not be able to be installed or would not be able to work properly... so prerequisites as a list are very confusing about it * Set the minimum requirements to be adequate and manageable: * A 1.5G root filesystem partition was sufficient using the netinstall iso and turning off recommendations, then sdisable auto-updates and create a cron job to clean up the apt package cache storage daily. This does not allow upgrades, but does allow updates. It means a 4G disk system drive is possible and valild. of course, these are for expert users... so I wrote sections of recommendations for novice users. * a 100M swap was sufficient. I configured Linux to not use swap at all... but novice users won't have the necessary skills, so... of course, these are for expert users... so I wrote sections of recommendations for novice users. * setting up a NAS system is easy with OMV, but a minimum of knowledge is required for inexperienced users, so I wrote such needs in each section. **Warning** I indicated that 1 disk is enough for both: system drive storage plus mixed with Data storage, that is basically true and officially supported, if you, as an expert administrator, simply install OMV on top of a fresh Debian setup customized with a free partition available for OMV data drive storage. This could be done by leaving a free partition already formatted also!
* requirements docs improved with missing information fixed * Addressed and closed #131, requirements talk about installation, not updates (not manageable updates), so the wording is correct because later on there are points about that, but i handled the issue in this commit in better way for. * Improve the very vague requirements documentation, that is also ambiguous in some way. * Not all software requirements are handled by the OS, for example we need a valid network for communications, if the network is unreachable clients are unable to reach any shared resources. * OMV is the most flexible NAS system. Pointed that out and tried to clarify all the needs about hardware and software. * Separate software requirements and hardware requirements. Previous document was very mixed about it, maybe this commit featured a too long one. I'm open to suggestions and leave this PR open to the editors and maintainers for. * Pointed out that Debian OS is the main software requirement. So then hardware requirements will rely based on OS hardware support! * Pointed out that NIC is a missing hardware requirement and why. It's a NAS system and wrote about that terminology as well. * Software requirements are handled by the OS and depend on it, but some packages were pointed out that are important to it, so there will be no confusion about it * The page should be titled "requirements" because hardware is a prerequisite, but it depends on the core software - the Debian OS, if such hardware is not supported, OMV would not be able to be installed or would not be able to work properly... so prerequisites as a list are very confusing about it * Set the minimum requirements to be adequate and manageable: * A 1.5G root filesystem partition was sufficient using the netinstall iso and turning off recommendations, then sdisable auto-updates and create a cron job to clean up the apt package cache storage daily. This does not allow upgrades, but does allow updates. It means a 4G disk system drive is possible and valild. of course, these are for expert users... so I wrote sections of recommendations for novice users. * a 100M swap was sufficient. I configured Linux to not use swap at all... but novice users won't have the necessary skills, so... of course, these are for expert users... so I wrote sections of recommendations for novice users. * setting up a NAS system is easy with OMV, but a minimum of knowledge is required for inexperienced users, so I wrote such needs in each section. **Warning** I indicated that 1 disk is enough for both: system drive storage plus mixed with Data storage, that is basically true and officially supported, if you, as an expert administrator, simply install OMV on top of a fresh Debian setup customized with a free partition available for OMV data drive storage. This could be done by leaving a free partition already formatted also! * Update prerequisites.rst per request! fix misspelled redundancy Co-authored-by: Volker Theile <[email protected]> * Update prerequisites.rst due misc spelling * dot point missing Co-authored-by: Volker Theile <[email protected]> * Update prerequisites.rst per requested * missing dot point at end of paragraph Co-authored-by: Volker Theile <[email protected]> * Update prerequisites.rst fix missing context for data drive Co-authored-by: Volker Theile <[email protected]> * Update prerequisites.rst per request! * mispelled word Co-authored-by: Volker Theile <[email protected]> * Update prerequisites.rst per request! misspelled * miscpelled xpected Co-authored-by: Volker Theile <[email protected]> * Update prerequisites.rst per request! resume context for IDE Co-authored-by: Volker Theile <[email protected]> * per request! fix several miscspelled and beter context for * Add a warning that 32bit works, but with OMV6 32bit support has been stopped officially. It should work, but it is not tested nor new features take care that they might not work on 32bit systems, this is thanks to arch independient technology of OMV development * Fix severals end of paragraphs without dot point. * Fix severals miscspelled Gib to GiB * Fix severals miscspelled words, like xpected, triks and "cos".. * Provide better context for "Spaghetti" sentences, remade all of them also those structurated as bumpy or vagues * update requirements : use x86/x64 for AMD64 and detail ARM also * Fix miscspelled archs, sorry this was very rare * x86-64, x64, x86_64 and x86 are valids for AMD64 cos have sabe base and same maning based on anunce in 1999 * separate names on the ARM cases, Debian already supports the 32bit of ARM but i guess OMV will works as same! * 32bit x86 must works cos is the same case, OMV just relies on Debian OS so all the pieces need will be there! * Improved filesystem details on technical notes about lifetime for SSD and complex features like compression. * Update prerequisites.rst disks list size respect brands hardware * add abbreviations for System disk drive and Data disk drives, usefully and reused for software part items in table * the hardware section its not about size, its about hardware per se, although the issue comes down to what Debian supports, devices should really be cited based on use and not based on minimum support, since Debian tries to cover everything while OMV is oriented to a specific task. The example is the difference between WD Black and WD Green, the second will wear out quickly if there is a lot of use. * Same change for software drives, use abbreviations for the item list, specified the size minimal disk, cos Windoze users always think that one disk is one partition, so minimize this table list to that, details such part in the paragraphs below * requirements: remove brands hardware, remove old oldstable, miscspelled fixes, swap optional * taking in consideration that SSD and HDD are still made and now there is the HHD (Helium Hard drives) those with helium inside for high demand storage .. in speciall NAS systems. the SDD is not the best for NAS systems, HDD/HHD are the best.. so i included the "HHD" inside the formula.. so this information will not be out of date in many years.. cos spining disks still are the best for long data * requirements: fix table mailformed * https://github.com/openmediavault/openmediavault-docs/actions/runs/12920764345/job/36033630346?pr=142 * prerequisites.rst:16: (ERROR/3) Malformed table. * prerequisites.rst:107: (ERROR/3) Malformed table. --------- Co-authored-by: Volker Theile <[email protected]> (cherry picked from commit 6f8aa59) Signed-off-by: Volker Theile <[email protected]>
Describe the improvement you'd like
Update the System Drive size requirements in prerequisites.rst
Additional context
The prerequisites at prerequisites.rst state that the System Drive should be min. 4 GiB capacity. With this capacity, on a fresh install, when I run the first update, the system runs out of space while installing linux-image-6.1.0-0.deb11.13-amd64 6.1.55-1~bpo11+1:
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